Astral Codex Ten

Phoenix

31 min read

Phoenix

Article

Phoenix is a recurring place in the Astral Codex Ten archive, appearing 18 times across 18 issues between February 12, 2021 and April 01, 2026. The archive places it in contexts such as “in the Phoenix suburb where the system was being tested, a pedestrian and Driverify-equipped car reached an intersection”; “PHOENIX, AZ”; “Miami, Phoenix, and Houston have year-round warm weather and far fewer homeless than San Francisco per capita”. It most often appears alongside California, Berkeley, San Francisco.

Metadata

  • Category: Places
  • Mention count: 18
  • Issue count: 18
  • First seen: February 12, 2021
  • Last seen: April 01, 2026

Appears In

Source Context

Recovered passages from the original issue text. When the raw archive preserved outbound links inside the source passage, they are listed directly under the quote.

List Of Fictional Cryptocurrencies Banned By The SEC
February 12, 2021 · Original source
Banned because: in the Phoenix suburb where the system was being tested, a pedestrian and Driverify-equipped car reached an intersection at the same time. The car dutifully wired a bid, but the pedestrian failed to respond. The car interpreted this as a bid of zero and ran into her. The pedestrian might have survived, except that the car realized it was at fault and tried to wire a fortune in Driverify directly into her nervous system, causing cardiac arrest. Elon Musk agreed to voluntarily withdraw the project until Neuralink could find a way to make pedestrians Driverify-compatible.
Spring Meetups In Seventy Cities
April 10, 2022 · Original source
PHOENIX, AZ Contact: Ben Morin (benjamin.j.morin@gmail.com) Date: April 30 Time: 11:00 AM Coordinates: https://plus.codes/8559FWF6+P8 Location: Encanto Park, Phoenix
Inline links: https://plus.codes/8559FWF6+P8
Book Review: San Fransicko
June 23, 2022 · Original source
That regression line looks suspicious, but I hear computers are never wrong. So one possible conclusion is that SF has around the amount of homelessness you would predict from its very high housing prices, and around the percent unsheltered you would predict from its balmy winter weather, and there’s nothing further to be explained. Shellenberger does not like this conclusion. San Francisco’s mild climate alone cannot explain why it has more homeless people than other cities. Miami, Phoenix, and Houston have year-round warm weather and far fewer homeless than San Francisco per capita. Per capita homelessness in San Francisco, Greater Miami, Greater Phoenix, and Greater Houston in 2020 was 9.3, 1.3, 1.6, and 0.8 per 1,000 residents, respectively. And Greater Miami, Greater Phoenix, and Greater Houston saw their per capita homeless population decline from 2005 to 2020 by 39, 17, and 74 percent while San Francisco saw its rise 30 percent. Nor can housing prices explain the discrepancy. Palo Alto and Beverly Hills have mild climates and expensive housing but don’t have San Francisco’s homeless problem. As for the Zillow study that was reported to find a correlation between rising rents and homelessness, a deeper look at the research reveals a more nuanced finding. Homelessness and affordability are correlated only in the context of certain “local policy efforts [and] social attitudes,” concluded researchers. This feels like kind of a shell game. San Francisco’s mild climate alone can’t explain why it has more homeless people per capita than Miami or Houston. But as the graph above shows, housing prices do explain about 75% of the difference between SF and those two cities. But because the book talks about the Miami-SF discrepancy in the paragraph about climate instead of the paragraph about prices, it makes it sound like a mystery that neither prices nor climate can explain. The Zillow article mentioned is Homelessness Rises Faster Where Rents Exceed A Third Of Incomes, which is based on this study. Shellenberger’s summary is not really the researchers’ conclusion. The article does mention “local attitudes” and “social policy” once, but only to explain that the paper includes a term representing “latent factors” that they’re not going to bother distinguishing from each other in their model, and some of those terms could be local policy or social attitudes. Later they mention there are some outliers in their model (eg Houston), and it would be reasonable to assume that the latent factors help explain the outliers, but they don’t give us any reason to think that this is more interesting than the fact that every model ever will have outliers. But also, this is one study by Zillow. Alyssa and I both tried the same analysis, and found the same thing, with a correlation that’s unusually high for this kind of work. Sure, there are outliers, but San Francisco isn’t one of them. San Francisco is only a couple of percent off where the regression line would predict. That leaves the point about Palo Alto and Beverly Hills. They “have mild climates and expensive housing but don’t have San Francisco’s homeless problem”. At first I felt like this was cheating - yeah, rich suburbs don’t have lots of homelessness, come on. But “rich” and “high property values” are pretty close to synonyms. If you’re going to say that high property values cause homelessness, isn’t it in fact pretty surprising that rich suburbs don’t have it? In fact, if you’re a homeless person, why wouldn’t you want to live in a suburb? Quieter (so probably easier to sleep at night) more places out of sight to pitch tents, less crime (important if you’re living on the street!), and potentially lower cost of living in terms of food and goods. I tried looking into this issue and found explanations like: Usually it’s poor people who become homeless. Cities have more poor people than suburbs, because they have more rental units, small apartments, public transportation, and blue-collar jobs. Suburbs, by natural consequence of their layout, enforce a certain wealth minimum before people can live there, and people above that wealth minimum rarely lose everything and become homeless. It’s strange that poor people tend to live in cities (ie places with very high land values), and you have to wonder whether there are ways that could be different, but it does seem true.
Inline links: Homelessness Rises Faster Where Rents Exceed A Third Of Incomes, this study
Highlights From The Comments On San Fransicko
June 29, 2022 · Original source
Unsigned Integer and several other people thought Phoenix/SF comparisons were unfair:
Inline links: Unsigned Integer
I wouldn't be surprised if Phoenix and Houston had few unsheltered homeless people because it was too hot to live outdoors. The human body doesn't have an air conditioning system (only evaporative cooling through sweat). So, if the temperature outside is above the range of normal human body temperatures, you *will* get heatstroke eventually, it's only a matter of time.
Why Is The Central Valley So Bad?
September 21, 2022 · Original source
I looked for photos of the Central Valley to illustrate this article, but none of them were quite as I remember it. This one from Sacramento Bee is the closest I could find. But imagine it through a layer of haze, and also you can’t see well because you are in the process of dying from heatstroke. Of large Central Valley cities, Sacramento has a median income of $33,565 (but it’s the state capital, which inflates it with politicians and lobbyists), Fresno of $25,738, and Bakersfield of $30,144. Compare to Mississippi, where the state capital of Jackson has $23,714, and numbers 2 and 3 cities Gulfport and Southhaven have $25,074 and $34,237. Overall Missisippi comes out worse here, and none of these seem horrible compared to eg Phoenix with $31,821. Given these numbers (from Google), urban salaries in the Central Valley don’t seem so bad. But when instead I look directly at this list of 280 US metropolitan areas by per capita income, numbers are much lower. Bakersfield at $15,760 is 260th/280, Fresno is 267th, and only Sacramento does okay at 22nd. Mississippi cities come in at 146, 202, and 251. Maybe the difference is because Google’s data is city proper and the list is metro area? Still, it seems fair to say that the Central Valley is at least somewhat in the same league as Mississippi, even though exactly who outscores whom is inconsistent. III. What do the people who live in the Valley think went wrong? What The Hell Is Wrong With California’s Central Valley?, starting around 9:30, interviews a local conservative realtor (most people in the Valley are conservative; I haven’t found a liberal equivalent). He says that the farms in the Central Valley used to be manned by migrant workers, who would come from Mexico, work for a season, then go back to Mexico and live off their earnings for the rest of the year. Later, policies shifted to welcoming them and granting them citizenship, so many of them came over and brought their families. But around the same time there was a drought, the farm industry crashed, the remaining farms mechanized, all the immigrants were left without work, they got on welfare, and they weren’t able to get off of it. He doesn’t say exactly when this happened, but he says times were good when he was a child, and he looks like he’s in his 30s or 40s. So if he’s 35 and things started going bad when he was 10, that would mean he thinks things started going bad around 1995 to 2000. Here’s a story in the LA Times from 1999, which talks about how things are starting to get bad. It admits that Californians like to poke fun at the Central Valley, but it seems to be just that - poking fun - and not freaking out about poverty and dysfunction the way articles about the Valley do now. But it ends by saying that things are getting worse: To be honest, living in the Central Valley takes some getting used to, especially if you’re from the coast. It’s an acquired taste. Oppressive heat in summer. Depressing tule fog in winter. Sure, fall and spring are OK. But where aren’t they? First-rate culture is scarce. The state capital doesn’t even have a symphony. One of the attractions--it’s almost a local joke--is the ability to get away, particularly from Sacramento. It’s 90 minutes to San Francisco in one direction, or skiing in another; two hours-plus to the ocean or Tahoe […] Still, earthquakes aren’t a menace to most people. And it doesn’t take long before you begin to appreciate certain benefits--indeed, to understand that some Central Valley burgs, especially the capital, are among California’s best kept secrets. Or, at least, they have been. Continuing: When I moved here nearly 40 years ago--the first of three times--summer skies were blue and the stars bright. Fishing was easy in the rivers and pheasant hunting was 10 minutes from town--in fact, where I now live. All this good life, however, has been changing. Sacramento is now the sixth smoggiest area in the country. A gloomy, beige pall greets motorists as they descend from the Sierra. Even worse is the San Joaquin Valley, from Stockton to Bakersfield. It’s rated the nation’s fourth smoggiest region […] And this brings us to the root problem: a population explosion, fed notably by commuters spilling over the Grapevine from L.A. into Bakersfield, and from the Bay Area into the northern San Joaquin Valley, turning farms into houses and freeways into parking lots. In Sacramento, high-tech industry is generating jobs and sprawl. Up and down the valley, people without job skills are having babies and going on welfare. Many are immigrants from Mexico and Southeast Asia. “The population is growing at a faster pace than the economy,” notes Dan Whitehurst, a former Fresno mayor who is running again. “Livability is becoming more of an issue. But the biggest issue still is jobs.” That’s because, aside from Sacramento, the Central Valley has not cashed in on California’s economic boom. Unemployment in the San Joaquin Valley is roughly double the state average. It’s smoggy. Traffic’s getting worse. Farms are disappearing. There aren’t enough jobs. And, says pollster Mark Baldassare, people are “myopic” about their plight. It finishes: “We have a huge problem. ‘No way L.A.’ has been our slogan. But if we build nonstop houses, we’ll be worse than L.A. because we’ll have destroyed our [farm] economic base. . . . There’s no regional leadership. More state officials need to decide this area matters and poke their heads up out of the fog.” The fog and the smog. If not, one day there’ll be no getting used to the place. This is a weird article. It seems to confirm that things used to be better - nobody would call the Central Valley “the good life” now. But its concerns are smog, sprawl, and decreasing share of agriculture. These seem like the problems of somewhere that’s growing - local NIMBYs complaining that too many people want to move in. Today the problem is more that everyone in the Central Valley wants to leave. The piece sort of touches on poverty - “people without job skills are having babies and going on welfare” and “the population is growing at a faster pace than the economy” - but it’s still a weird emphasis, and one that makes me think of this as supporting the “problems were starting in the 90s” view. But by 2012, things were clearly very bad - here’s an article about how Census Shows Central Valley Areas Among Poorest In Nation. It says: Experts say the poverty problem in the nation’s agricultural powerhouse is deeply ingrained. The most important barrier is the valley’s lack of economic diversity. There are simply too few good nonagricultural jobs around and jobs in agriculture tend to be low-wage ones — except for those who run agribusinesses. “It’s a pretty ag-heavy region, so the inequality of wages and the opportunity to earn better wages is really skewed,” said Caroline Farrell, executive director of the Delano-based Center on Race, Poverty & the Environment. “If you own a farm, you’re apt to earn more wealth, while if you’re a farmworker, don’t earn very much.” The valley has not been able to bring or retain many new companies partly because it lacks a qualified workforce, said Atonio Avalos, associate professor of economics at Fresno State University. “We have an issue of skills mismatch,” Avalos said. “Companies may be offering jobs, but the skills of people in the valley are not ones they are looking for.” Students who want to get a college degree face many barriers, he said, and public funding for education is being slashed. Those who do graduate leave to find jobs elsewhere. The valley also doesn’t offer attractive amenities and has serious problems such as air pollution that have gone unaddressed. “If you’re a doctor or engineer, there are other places where you can make good money and live in better conditions,” Avalos said. “Many people don’t come here or leave because of the high incidence of asthma and other respiratory problems.” This sounds like things were already pretty bad in 2012, maybe bad enough that they must have been getting worse for longer than 10 or 15 years, I don’t know. IV. What do the data say? Here are some economic time series. I couldn’t find any good long-term ones; the least bad one comes from this unsourced report: Here it looks like things got worse from 1975 - 1985, and then depending on county there was a slower-to-imperceptible decline thereafter. FRED only has data since 1989, but agrees that things haven’t gotten worse since then. Here’s unemployment: Is this just because people got discouraged (or on welfare) and stopped seeking employment, and so stopped showing up in the statistics? Here’s a graph of Total Employed Persons: In 1990, 303,000 people were employed out of a population of 354,000. In 2022, 430,000 people were employed out of a population of 542,000. So labor participation rate went from 86% to 79%. But national labor force participation decreased by about the same amount during that time, so I don’t think we should overemphasize that. And here are some other graphs I found useful: Fresno housing prices: Racial demographics: Source: Wikipedia. Central Valley cities like Fresno and Bakersfield aren’t really more Hispanic than other parts of California or Arizona, so if immigration or racial issues played a part it must have been more complicated than just numbers. Number of immigrants in California over time: Factors of productivity in agriculture: V. So why is the Central Valley so bad? It’s an agricultural region, but lots of places are agricultural. It got lots of immigrants, but no more than many other places. It’s polluted - but so was LA, and LA rebounded. This is just a weak guess, but I think it starts with their crops. The Midwest grows mostly corn and wheat. The Central Valley is more fruits, vegetables, and nuts. Corn and wheat are easier to harvest, so middle-class farmers can own the farm and buy a mechanical harvester or something. Fruits, vegetables, and nuts benefit from intensive manual picking, so farm owners hire outside labor. According to Carolina Demography: There are about 3 million farmworkers in the United States: about two million are family farmworkers and another one million are hired farmworkers…nationally, about three-fourths of hired farmworkers are foreign-born; most (69%) were born in Mexico; 6% were born in Central America; and 1% were born in another country. Given that these are mostly Mexican immigrants, we’re probably not talking about people who are hired to grow corn in Kansas. I think plausibly the majority of US hired farmworkers live in California’s Central Valley. This makes it a sort of plantation agriculture system, which naturally tends towards landowners taking all the gains and workers ending up as an underclass. In the mid-20th century, the local plantation underclass was made of Okies (cf. The Grapes of Wrath). In the later 20th century, many immigrants moved in, lowering wages. Although immigrants don’t usually lower wages, this is because there are usually lots of industries for people to branch out into, but the Central Valley only has agriculture. Also, agribusinesses were becoming better at mechanizing their operations. Although technology doesn’t usually lower wages, again, this requires lots of diverse industries, and the Central Valley only had agriculture. All of this corresponds to the 1975-1985 period on the graphs where wages were going down. But it sounded from some of the testimonials above like the Central Valley didn’t become truly miserable until the late 90s. I’m not sure why this is. It could be the immigrants switching from being migrant laborers to raising families, and those families were impacted by poverty and inequality in a way the original migrants weren’t. It could be worsening drug problems as new drugs get invented and go down in price. (I’m not sure if NIMBYism and rising house prices also played a part. House prices do seem to have risen, a lot, but I was under the impression that building things in the Central Valley was easy and most of a house’s price there is construction rather than land. I’m not sure why house prices would have gone up so much since 1990 if this were true, though.) Other things that the articles I read emphasized: There’s a severe drought in the Central Valley right now. This is probably partly climate change, partly bad luck, and partly California diverting water to hydrate growing coastal cities. This has made everything worse (but then why isn’t that reflected in worsening economic statistics?)
Inline links: Sacramento Bee, from Google, list of 280 US metropolitan areas by per capita income, What The Hell Is Wrong With California’s Central Valley, Here’s a story, Census Shows Central Valley Areas Among Poorest In Nation, this unsourced report, https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/$s_!viUA!,f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F3cb60f00-5048-44dc-8ad3-49d9036437e8_632x382.png, https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/$s_!jJHH!,f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2Faf442355-432b-4ac1-b10d-2ebf17011084_1151x345.png, https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/$s_!oETP!,f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F1fe3e7f8-9e13-4295-b608-d071425d6adc_1116x300.png, decreased by about the same amount, https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/$s_!is_P!,f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F09af8185-c8cf-4879-999c-4643ec7d7079_989x590.png, https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/$s_!K8wW!,f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F6ce47fbd-0a84-4461-a96c-07a2d8130d4e_412x104.png, https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/$s_!Vvxn!,f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2Fe95d035a-8dea-410c-8b8f-19acb145859e_676x356.png, https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/$s_!xlsr!,f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F36965205-4cb9-4f93-b855-91cc6b9047b5_450x397.png, Carolina Demography, Okies
Highlights From The Comments On The Central Valley
October 13, 2022 · Original source
Weather: It's not as hot as Yuma or Phoenix or [list of other too-hot cities]. It's still too hot.
Spring Meetups Everywhere 2023
April 10, 2023 · Original source
PHOENIX, ARIZONA, USA Contact: Ben Contact Info: benjamin[dot]j[dot]morin[at]gmail[dot]com Time: Saturday, May 06th, 02:00 PM Location: Kiwanis Park, Tempe, Ramada #12 next to the picnic area Coordinates: https://plus.codes/855C93F6+45P
Inline links: https://plus.codes/855C93F6+45P
Open Thread 273
April 24, 2023 · Original source
1: New spring meetups added since I last updated you: Phoenix, Arizona; Melbourne, Australia. Check the list for dates and times
Inline links: spring meetups
Berkeley Meetup This Saturday
May 05, 2023 · Original source
Why: Because we’re having another round of spring meetups, and Berkeley is one of them. I’m signal-boosting this one because I’ll be attending, as will Meetups Czar Skyler. Other meetups this weekend include Chicago, Phoenix, Richmond, Kuala Lumpur, Fort Lauderdale, Bangalore, Melbourne, and Budapest. See the full list here for other cities’ times and dates.
Inline links: another round of spring meetups
Spring Meetups Everywhere 2024
March 30, 2024 · Original source
PHOENIX, ARIZONA, USA Contact: Nathan Contact Info: natoboo2000[at]gmail[dot]com Time: Saturday, May 4th, 3:00 PM Location: Encanto Park 2499 N 15th Ave, Phoenix, AZ 85007. We'll be at one of the picnic tables just south of the parking lot, with an ACX meetups sign at the table. Coordinates: https://plus.codes/8559FWG5+9RP Event Link: https://www.lesswrong.com/events/KRcNWJusPhdLrvvxx/acx-phoenix-may-meetup Group Link: https://www.lesswrong.com/groups/xSLmmoudDGM2w8JEG Notes: RSVPs on LessWrong appreciated: https://www.lesswrong.com/events/KRcNWJusPhdLrvvxx/acx-phoenix-may-meetup
Inline links: https://www.lesswrong.com/events/KRcNWJusPhdLrvvxx/acx-phoenix-may-meetup, https://www.lesswrong.com/groups/xSLmmoudDGM2w8JEG
Within each region it’s alphabetized first by country then by city - so the first entry in Europe is Vienna, Austria. The exception is the USA, where they’re also alphabetized by state - so the first entry in the USA is Phoenix, Arizona.
Open Thread 327
April 28, 2024 · Original source
1: More meetups this week, in Istanbul, Edinburgh, Manchester, Phoenix, Fort Meade, Brooklyn, Hanoi, and New Orleans. And Sao Paulo has been added to the list. More information, including times and dates, here.
Inline links: here
Highlights From The Comments On Mentally Ill Homeless People
July 18, 2024 · Original source
$1 billion/year in projected costs, translated into Californian, means $100 trillion quadrillion/year in actual costs. Of these, I think 3 is the biggest deal. If it’s as hard to commit someone to these institutions as it is to convict them of a crime, then these institutions don’t help much above how much the existence of prison also helps (eg not much). If you invent a new legal maneuver where it’s easier to commit someone than to convict them of a crime, then why do you even need the step where you build the institution? Just invent the legal maneuver and send more people to prison! I think that maybe the thought is that the institution seems more “humane” than prison, and so people will be more willing to allow low-friction legal maneuvers for confining people there. I think this is cope; not only won’t the institutions be more humane than prisons, but people won’t believe they are and won’t allow the low-friction legal maneuvers. Drethelin writes: What if we abolish the DEA and just let anyone buy anti-psychotics over the counter? This would be the FDA we’re abolishing, but otherwise yes, this is the sort of clever outside-the-box thinking that I appreciate from my commenters. Antipsychotics are very cheap (some well-regarded drugs like Abilify and Seroquel cost about ~$10 per month of pills). On the other hand, homeless people have very little money. So if you were going to do this, it would make sense for the government to give them away for free. These drugs have many potentially serious side effects. But it’s not clear how much homeless people’s 5-minute monthly visits with a bored Medicaid doctor does to avert these side effects, over having some kind of pharmacist or advocate or social worker in the free distribution center giving helpful advice. Like everything, I think this would only help around the edges - the fraction of homeless mentally ill people who drugs can help, who are willing to take the drugs, and who are prevented only by cost and bureaucracy. What percent is that? Low confidence guess 25%. DZ writes: I think you’re missing the goal of a short arrest (few days). Part of the problem is the homeless are in areas where society doesn’t want them to be. They’re near city downtowns where tourists spend time or near commercial districts or in otherwise nice parks. If you can arrest them for a few days and keep arresting them until they move somewhere else … the goal is to eventually force them to move to the more acceptable areas vs. least acceptable areas. This is obviously not ideal but in the mean time the city gets more tourism, more office rentals, etc. Europeans ruthlessly arrest homeless people who hang out in the touristy areas. SF doesn’t, yet. I commented that I was worried that “out of touristy areas” means “into residential areas”. And I feel worse making residents deal with this than tourists, and am less confident that the city cares enough about them to fight back. DZ responded: Agreed. People don’t want them in the residential areas or suburbs either and for good reason. But my guess is cities can identify certain areas where they would prefer the tents to set up. Something like industrial areas or run down parks. The key is that city officials should be able to use arrests as a strategy to move the tents/homeless concentrations without having to face a million lawsuits. I don’t know if there are really areas like this, but I welcome learning more from people who know cities better. SMK writes: This probably sounds draconian and cruel, too, but in fairness, all these discussions seem to assume that this person is in San Francisco and can never ever leave for some other, more affordable place. I get it -- it's tough leaving home, and maybe they'd be leaving friends. But they wouldn't be the only people leaving SF over rent prices, and they'd pretty clearly be among the most rational. So I dislike articles like this when they say things like "the average wait time for a homeless shelter bed is 826 days" or "cheap apartments in SF are $1000 / month." I have a friend who was homeless for around a year in another major American city, and he said it was always 100% feasible to get a shelter bed if he wanted one. Indeed, there were several options. On a different note, I also think that if one were going to go a "cruel and draconian" route, homeless shelters might be able to change policies to better support that and prevent some of the issues you highlight. If it takes 826 days to get a shelter bed, then zero of the typical people you mention who are briefly homeless are getting shelter beds. If all of the people who were homeless for longer were either leaving or in jail, then more of those people probably would get beds. Am I saying this is the policy I favor? No, I agree it's a hard problem and I'm not sure what the right answer is. But things like this need to be kept in mind, too. Again, I think it’s helpful to go to the specific policy level. What’s the policy here? Give homeless people brochures reminding them that other cities exist? I’m sure they know this. Give homeless cities free mandatory bus trips to those other cities? What prevents the other cities from giving them free mandatory bus trips back? Even if they don’t, what if the homeless prefer being homeless in San Francisco to having a better situation in a cheaper city? A bus from Phoenix to SF is only $60; even a homeless beggar might be able to scrounge up that much money if they’re motivated. Maybe some plan like making a deal with a big cheap city in Texas to take SF homeless in exchange for money, and as soon as the homeless get off the bus, they’re met by a Texan social worker who gives them a shelter bed and social services? Might help along the edges, but remember that only about half of homeless people want/will accept shelter beds (depending on how good the shelter beds are). Sergei writes: After checking a bit, let me point out the obvious. What works elsewhere is PATERNALISM. Once you are in the "clutches of psychiatry", they don't let you go. Upon release you are placed into some sort of housing, your appointments are monitored and a social worker will find you and drive you there. You will be given multiple chances to get a job and/or rehab. Your meds will be delivered to you if you cannot pick them up. They remind you to take them. There will be a social safety net so you are never in a situation where you end up on the street unless you really really try to. In retrospect, it makes sense: people who are not able to take care of themselves for a time because of a fixable mental infirmity are taken care of by the state, until they can. That's what we do with children already. I continue to want people to provide details. “They don't let you go" - okay, so the person is in a locked facility? Placed in "some kind of housing"? Does the housing have locks on the door, or can they leave? What if they do leave? "Multiple chances to get a job", oh, great, with whom? How are you enforcing that they take mentally ill people? What happens when the mentally ill people are less good workers than other people they could hire, or have some kind of crisis on the job, as even the best-treated person might once in a while? Maybe we can charitably fill in the details. Something like: Ban some combination of camping outside and being visibly mentally ill.
Inline links: writes
Meetups Everywhere 2024: Times & Places
August 29, 2024 · Original source
Contact: Mark Contact Info: FLWAB[at]protonmail[dot]com Time: Saturday, September 21st, 01:30 PM Location: Kaladi Brothers Coffee, 6861 Jewel Lake Rd, Anchorage, AK, 99502. We’ll be in the community room and I’ll have a sign. Coordinates: https://plus.codes/93HG525X+7J Notes: Feel free to bring kids. Arizona PHOENIX, ARIZONA, USA Contact: Nathan Contact Info: natoboo2000[at]gmail[dot]com Time: Saturday, September 14th, 03:00 AM Location: 20 W 6th St, Tempe, AZ 85281, USA Coordinates: https://plus.codes/855CC3F5+QJ Group Link: https://discord.com/invite/ANSywQABEF Notes: Please RSVP on Lesswrong so that I can get a general gauge of how many people are coming: https://www.lesswrong.com/events/Eq2PYKCMBM9cGsFQP/acx-phoenix-september-meetup
Inline links: https://plus.codes/93HG525X+7J, https://plus.codes/855CC3F5+QJ, https://discord.com/invite/ANSywQABEF
Contact: Nathan Contact Info: natoboo2000[at]gmail[dot]com Time: Saturday, September 14th, 03:00 AM Location: 20 W 6th St, Tempe, AZ 85281, USA Coordinates: https://plus.codes/855CC3F5+QJ Group Link: https://discord.com/invite/ANSywQABEF Notes: Please RSVP on Lesswrong so that I can get a general gauge of how many people are coming: https://www.lesswrong.com/events/Eq2PYKCMBM9cGsFQP/acx-phoenix-september-meetup
Inline links: https://plus.codes/855CC3F5+QJ, https://discord.com/invite/ANSywQABEF
Meetups Everywhere Spring 2025: Times & Places
March 25, 2025 · Original source
Contact: Tim Contact Info: timothy[period]n[period]jesionowski[a t]gmail[period]com Time: Saturday, April 26th, 2:00 PM Location: The Nook. 3305 Bob Wallace Ave SW I'll be in a black leather jacket, ask Monika if you can't find me. Coordinates: https://plus.codes/866MP96Q+F6 Arizona PHOENIX Contact: Nathan Contact Info: natoboo2000[a t]gmail[period]com Time: Friday, May 16th, 5:30 PM Location: The Churchill. Covered, open-air space with misters. Food hall. I'll have a sign saying ACX. Coordinates: https://plus.codes/8559FW5H+44 Group Link: https://discord.com/invite/ANS[remove this part]ywQABEF, https://www.lesswrong.com/groups/xSLmmoudDGM2w8JEG
Inline links: https://plus.codes/866MP96Q+F6, https://plus.codes/8559FW5H+44, https://www.lesswrong.com/groups/xSLmmoudDGM2w8JEG
Open Thread 381
May 12, 2025 · Original source
1: ACX meetups this week in Bengaluru, Mexico City, Phoenix, Ann Arbor, and Denver. See the post for details.
Inline links: the post
Meetups Everywhere 2025: Times and Places
August 29, 2025 · Original source
Contact: Nathan Contact Info: natoboo2000[a t]gmail[period]com Time: Saturday, September 13th, 3:00 PM Location: 901 N 1st St, Phoenix, AZ 85004. We'll have a table sign saying "ACX MEETUP", and plan to be at the high tables in the back of the courtyard. Coordinates: https://plus.codes/8559FW5H+54 Group Link: https://www.lesswrong.com/groups/xSLmmoudDGM2w8JEG Notes: Please RSVP on LessWrong so I can get a rough estimate of how many people to expect.
Inline links: https://plus.codes/8559FW5H+54, https://www.lesswrong.com/groups/xSLmmoudDGM2w8JEG
Contact: Tim Contact Info: SentientMollusk[a t]protonmail[period]com Time: Monday, October 27th, 2:00 PM Location: We will be in the Barnes and Noble Cafe at the Bridge Street shopping mall. I will have a black leather jacket on my chair (or possibly on my person). Coordinates: https://plus.codes/866MP88H+43 Group Link: https://light-machines.org/ Notes: We have meetups posted on the website through October! If you can't make the September meetup, feel free to check back later. Arizona PHOENIX Contact: Nathan Contact Info: natoboo2000[a t]gmail[period]com Time: Saturday, September 13th, 3:00 PM Location: 901 N 1st St, Phoenix, AZ 85004. We'll have a table sign saying "ACX MEETUP", and plan to be at the high tables in the back of the courtyard. Coordinates: https://plus.codes/8559FW5H+54 Group Link: https://www.lesswrong.com/groups/xSLmmoudDGM2w8JEG Notes: Please RSVP on LessWrong so I can get a rough estimate of how many people to expect.
Inline links: https://plus.codes/866MP88H+43, https://plus.codes/8559FW5H+54, https://www.lesswrong.com/groups/xSLmmoudDGM2w8JEG
Open Thread 398
September 08, 2025 · Original source
1: Meetups this week include Abuja, Dublin, Ho Chi Minh City, London, Manchester, Montevideo, Montreal, Moscow, Munich, Nairobi, Ottawa, Rio, Santiago, Singapore, Stockholm, Tokyo, Baltimore, Berkeley, Madison, Phoenix, Pittsburgh, Seattle, and many others. And late additions to the meetup list include Vilnius, Haifa, Vegas, and Durham. See the list for more.
Inline links: Berkeley, the list
Meetups Everywhere Spring 2026: Times & Places
April 01, 2026 · Original source
Within each region it’s alphabetized first by country then by city - so the first entry in Europe is Vienna, Austria. The exception is the USA, where they’re also alphabetized by state - so the first entry in the USA is Phoenix, Arizona.
Contact: Eddie Contact Info: acxcdmx[@]gmail[.]com Time: Saturday, May 16th, 4:00 PM Location: Feel free to join us at Cafebrería El Péndulo, Condesa, for coffee, drinks, and rationalist-related conversation. Coordinates: https://plus.codes/76F2CR6G+6R Group Link: https://www.lesswrong.com/groups/uzTxYaFupgz9ZnCT5 United States of America Arizona PHOENIX Contact: Nathan Contact Info: natoboo2000[@]gmail[.]com Time: Sunday, May 10th, 1:45 PM Location: 3500 S Rural Rd, Tempe, AZ 85282, USA We’ll be in the Tempe Library, Ironwood Classroom (the front desk can give you directions thru the hallways) Coordinates: https://plus.codes/855C93RC+HP Group Link: https://discord.com/invite/ANSyw [remove this bit] QABEF Notes: RSVP not required, but much appreciated!
Inline links: https://plus.codes/76F2CR6G+6R, https://www.lesswrong.com/groups/uzTxYaFupgz9ZnCT5, https://plus.codes/855C93RC+HP